Which seems to be a more constructive way of bridging the gap between the generations.
Yeah, because it’s fun for kids to be treated as older people. Your worst memories of childhood always involve someone treating you like a little kid, not giving you any respect, you know? That happens early; by fifth grade, you’re certainly dealing with it. Someone’s telling you what to do all the time. And you’re your own person by that age; I know, because I have a 10-year-old daughter. At that age, you’re a complex psychology in full bloom.
Did you see any of that maturation in action as these kids grappled with working together musically as a group?
Yeah. They were already pretty cohesive and got along really well, but it was fun to see them become a band. It didn’t take long. Kids are so adaptable. It was just fun to see them have such a good time. And they really took it in. I could sit and talk to them about their characters and I don’t think they ever felt that I was pushing them too much. I was never making it all about pleasing me or anything; it was all about them doing their thing, being cool and having a good time. They weren’t thinking that I was the guy that they were working for. You know, “the Director.” I was just trying to be like an older brother or an uncle. I never had to ride them hard; they were always good.
Are you worried at all about the future of independents, especially with this FCC debacle about media ownership? Can the independent spirit survive in that kind of environment?
I don’t know, but I think it’s always been that way. It’s disturbing to think that a few companies are going to own everything; that sounds ominous. But people will discover that independent spirit on their own. I think, in this film, Dewey is giving kids a jump on things they might have experienced later in life. But it’s up to each individual to explore their pop-culture past, and they’re going to. They’re going to check out music from different eras, or follow a thread from something they like back into the past. If they’re curious, that is. If they’re not … well, they’re already consumers anyway. But there will be those who do explore things that mean something to them. The message of this movie isn’t just that they’re consumers; it’s more about them realizing that they can be in a band and have fun.
Everyone is mostly interested in people — kids in particular — as consumers, but this movie is more about showing kids that they can express themselves. I think that’s a positive thing to tell people. I think people are always going to rebel and create; you can never stop that. There will always be a creative force out in the margins; the creative rebel spirit will find its place.
How do think that independent spirit has changed over time since you made “Slacker”?
I think it’s the same, I really do. I don’t think things change much. I mean, back then it hadn’t changed much from the previous generation. The thing that changes is the business, you know, the distributors and the theaters. There’s a continuum that goes back to the late ’50s and early ’60s that’s been fairly consistent. I think the difference is that now there are more people making films, whether it’s indie or digital or whatever. There are a lot of people doing it now. But that’s good, you know?
I mean, not everyone’s a director. I’ve always said that everyone should be able to make a film, but that doesn’t mean everyone should make a film! (Laughs.) Just like everyone should be able to write a book or paint a picture. But you’ll find out who’s good at it, who has talent. I mean, I grew up thinking that it wasn’t an option. Growing up in East Texas, making films just was not a career choice. It wasn’t until my early 20s that it even crossed my mind as a possibility. I always thought I’d be a writer.
How did it eventually cross your mind?
I just started getting interested in movies. I was studying theater, but something about film, probably the visuals, clicked for me. It tapped into my mind. And it might have been the combination of the writing, the technical aspects of storytelling, and the whole visual apparatus, but it just took over and I never looked back. It might have happened to me earlier had I ever thought about it. It just wasn’t put out there.
What was it that gave you the hunger to express yourself? It seems to me that kids are growing up today without realizing that expressing themselves in a creative way is an option, as you say.
Well, I felt that my whole life, to be honest. Even as far back as second grade, I was always writing. I always felt I would do something like that, but I didn’t know what. It’s also the environment you grow up in; there’s never much encouragement for that, you know? Most people are so obsessed with getting their kids into the right college or job. No one ever says, “What will be fun? How will you express yourself and have a good time in this life?” That doesn’t figure into most parents’ thinking.
I think you’ve got to link the two together.
Well, they should be. The best teachers will say that: “You really learn when you’re goofing off.” That’s how my rehearsals were, but we were also honing the movie. We’re finding humor and writing it down, but it’s about play. The best teachers you ever had? They made it fun. You looked forward to that class, to reading that story and talking about it. Anything can be made into drudgery if there’s no enthusiasm. It’s that old saying — “Nothing great ever comes without enthusiasm.” Much better than doing everything by rote.
Which leads me to the Austin Film Society. How has your enthusiasm changed it over the years?
We’ve been watching movies since 1985, and now we’re giving out grants. I just believe in local film culture; I like the idea of watching movies with an audience that hangs out and talks about them afterwards. I love the social, communal aspect of movies; mainstream cinema is good for that because people still go to the theaters. But when it comes to repertory or the history of film, more and more that’s something you see at home on video or DVD. Which is fine, but I still value those moments with a group in the theater; that’s increasingly become harder to do, economically. But we manage pretty well.
Does it give you a sense of satisfaction to share that enthusiasm with the community you came up in?
Oh yeah. I’ve always felt that the Film Society is an equally expressive outlet of my passion for film, even more so. When I spend a year of my life on one film, well, that’s just one film. But I probably communicate with more people by showing 100 films a year that we’ve picked from world cinema or curating a series. That’s equally important, and to me it’s the same. I mean, the French New Wave all thought that cinema was just a part of your life; you live it, whether you’re writing or creating it. Unfortunately, the busier I get, the less I get to do with the Film Society. I’m still artistic director, but I’m in and out of their orbit. Yet I just love the communal aspect of it; we’ve built up a serious film community.
So what’s next for you?
Actually, as we speak, I’m editing another film. When I finished the “School of Rock” sound mix, I flew to Paris the next day and shot a film that I’ve been working on for the last year, a continuation of “Before Sunrise” with Ethan Hawke and Julie Delpy. It’s those same characters nine years later. It’s very low budget; we shot it in like three weeks. I like them; they’re great collaborators. They were in “Waking Life” as well. It’s important to work with people you’re on the same page with.
Speaking of “Waking Life,” where would you rank that in your body of work so far?
It’s all integral; there’s certainly a thread that runs from “Slacker” to “Waking Life.” That’s how my mind works — in the narrative vein, using film as a storytelling medium. “Waking Life” was something that I thought about forever. It actually predated “Slacker,” but I just didn’t know how to do it. It was the animation technique that brought it to a boil. When I saw Bob’s animation, it was the “Eureka!” moment.
It seems like a “Eureka!” moment for others too. I’m starting to see a lot of commercials using a similar method.
Oh definitely, it’s been totally ripped off. They’re cribbing the style the best they can. They don’t have his software, but they’re going for the look. His software is already at a new level. I was actually thinking of doing another animation film. Something in a totally new direction.
Do artists have a duty to push that envelope, move things in a new direction?
I think you can’t help it. When you dig into the human spirit, you’re going to explore and push the parameters of genre and technology. I always felt shackled into narrative, period, so I’m pushing storytelling. Maybe not on something like “School of Rock,” but other films. There’s a part of me that enjoys that, pushing the envelope, and then there’s a part of me that enjoys the traditional stuff. It’s all about tapping into the different parts of your brain.
This interview appeared at Salon